Using Empathy to Foster Social Impact with Joseph Cope
This episode is brought to you by Donorbox. They're offering 20% off Donorbox Premium annual plans until the end of the year. Transform your fundraising strategy effortlessly with Donorbox, the online fundraising platform that streamlines your process, elevates your donations, and ensures a user-friendly experience for your supporters. Schedule a Donorbox Premium demo and unlock the discount at https://bit.ly/donorbox-premium-discount.
In This Episode
In an era where social change often feels like one step forward and two back, this impactful conversation with "The Empathy Guy," Joseph Cope, offers a fresh perspective on how to move the needle on significant social issues.
Thanks to Joseph, leaders around the country have begun to discover one of the keys to authentic human connection—the most unheralded of leadership superpowers—empathy.
For anyone who has ever felt frustrated by resistance to change in their organization or struggled to bridge the gap between different perspectives, this will provide you with supportive strategies to make change.
Through real-world examples and actionable insights, you'll discover how to transform challenging relationships with leadership, colleagues, and stakeholders into opportunities for meaningful connection and change.
About Joseph Cope
Joseph Cope is a keynote speaker, corporate workshop presenter, and empathy coach. Two decades of work with the world’s most misunderstood population, American teenagers, have helped this award-winning and former middle-school educator develop an empathy-driven and outside-the-box perspective that he shares with leaders who feel stuck with the status quo.
Connect with Joseph Cope
Connect with Maria
Speaking & Training | LinkedIn | Email
Transcripts
I have been grappling with what it takes to move the needle on big social change, including normalizing trauma informed storytelling. I have been wondering what role empathy plays in our movements.
So it just makes sense to bring on Joseph Cope, also known as The Empathy Guy.
Joseph is a speaker and trainer who helps leaders across the country discover one of the keys to authentic human connection: empathy.
Maria Bryan:
Welcome to the show.
Joseph Cope:
Maria, I am really excited to be here. I feel honored to be here, and I appreciate the invitation. I am excited to have this conversation.
Maria Bryan:
You are The Empathy Guy, and we have a lot to talk about and ruminate on. Let’s start with empathy. How do you define it?
Joseph Cope:
That is a loaded question.
As I was preparing for the show, I asked myself how empathy is commonly defined, and how I am trying to redefine it for people who most need to learn about it.
Empathy is often defined as the ability to feel another person’s feelings with them. I think that is a good surface level definition.
What I want to challenge is the idea that some people have empathy and others do not. I see empathy as a skill.
Think of it like a seed that everyone has. For some people, it has been nurtured and grown. For others, it has been buried or covered. And for some, it has grown in response to experiences they did not choose.
You talk a lot about trauma informed storytelling. Many people in your audience likely identify as empaths. But how often has empathy gotten in the way of accountability, deadlines, or clear communication? How often has it been misinterpreted?
Everyone has the capacity for empathy. The question is how we tune it so it becomes a gateway to human connection instead of something that feels overwhelming, weak, or unsafe.
For me, empathy is the missing skill that can reconnect humanity.
Maria Bryan:
There is so much there.
Before we go further, I want to talk about your journey. You have such a meaningful path that led you to this work. Can you share a bit about your background as an educator and what you learned along the way?
Joseph Cope:
When I entered education, I was known as the rapport guy. For me, education was always a conduit for relationship. Human connection was the outcome I cared about most.
Recently, two former students reached out to me on LinkedIn. They had moved to Austin, where I live, and wanted to get lunch. They are young adults now.
During lunch, one of them said, “There are teachers we forget, teachers who were good, and teachers who made an impact.” Hearing that still brings me to tears.
Those were seventh grade boys, and eight years later, they looked me up just to connect.
I told one of them, Genesis, that now I get to take what made our classroom special and talk about it with leaders and organizations. I asked him what he remembered most.
He said, “In your class, we didn’t have rules. We had goals.”
One example was classroom goal number nine: show self control. When Genesis struggled to sit still, instead of calling him out, I would quietly ask him to look at goal number nine. It gave him the opportunity to reflect rather than feel punished.
That approach allowed students to feel seen, heard, and valued, while still being accountable.
Maria Bryan:
Listening to you, I am thinking about parenting. Empathy requires understanding developmental stages, whether you are teaching middle schoolers or raising young children. What a powerful place to practice empathy.
Joseph Cope:
Absolutely.
Now that I work primarily with adults, I have reflected on the difference. Children need guidance, and we expect that. Adults also need guidance, but not everyone recognizes that.
Children need structure to become healthy members of society. Teenagers begin pushing for autonomy. The more that autonomy is suppressed, the more resistance shows up.
Adults are no different. Adults need to understand the value of the systems they are part of, or they will fight against them.
As leaders, the question becomes whether we can hold enough empathy to help people see both themselves and the system clearly.
Maria Bryan:
I often talk about kindness, grace, and empathy as my guiding values.
For nonprofit and social good storytellers, empathy shows up in two key ways. The first is empathy for story owners and communities, especially when there are differences in lived experience. That empathy helps prevent saviorism and harmful narratives.
The second is harder. It is empathy for leaders, boards, or colleagues who do not yet share these values.
People complete trauma informed storytelling trainings and return to organizations that resist change. They hit wall after wall. Many leave the sector because of it.
What does empathy look like in those situations?
Joseph Cope:
I want to answer this in two parts. First, the three circles. Second, values as the bridge.
The three circles are what you can control, what you can influence, and what is out of your control. The circle to focus on is influence.
If what is out of your control begins to dominate your energy, it shrinks your influence. Your job is to protect that center circle.
Now, values are the bridge.
Even the leader you are frustrated with is likely motivated by the organization’s stated values. Compassion, service, social justice, authenticity. Those values came from somewhere meaningful.
When you lead emotionally rather than reactively, you can connect your values to the organization’s values. The conversation shifts from personal conflict to shared purpose.
Instead of “me versus you,” it becomes “how do we live these values more fully?”
Maria Bryan:
That middle circle of influence really resonates with me. Influence often takes time. Sometimes influence looks like modeling rather than changing policy overnight.
You might not change systems today, but you might change how one story is told, or how one colleague thinks about consent, language, or dignity.
That matters.
Joseph Cope:
Exactly.
Sometimes simply naming what you cannot control is freeing. You cannot control your boss’s mood, funding cycles, or every outcome.
But you can hold yourself accountable to your values and choose how you show up.
Here is an empathy hack. As long as empathy is focused only on yourself, it will feel weak. When you focus on the benefit to the other person, empathy becomes powerful.
When someone feels seen and understands the gain for them, change becomes possible.
Maria Bryan:
How can people practice empathy sustainably without becoming emotionally overwhelmed?
Joseph Cope:
No one becomes an empathy expert overnight.
I use a framework called the CARGO model. It helps distinguish between baggage and intention.
C is for connection. How can I humanly connect right now?
A is for accountability. Am I aligned with my values in this moment?
R is for resistance. What might be beneath the surface of someone else’s behavior?
G is for gain. What is the benefit to the other person if change happens?
O is for outlook. Am I focused on the outcome, or can I shift the outlook just a little right now?
Shifting outlooks, even slightly, creates momentum.
Maria Bryan:
This is incredibly impactful. Social justice work is a long journey, and empathy is essential to sustaining it.
I appreciate how practical and grounded your frameworks are.
Joseph, people are going to want to connect with you. How can they do that?
Joseph Cope:
The best place is my website, empathyguy.com. People are welcome to connect, book time, and share their stories. I love hearing them.
Maria Bryan:
Thank you so much for this conversation and for your wisdom. I am grateful for you.
Joseph Cope:
Thank you. It has been a pleasure.
The When Bearing Witness Podcast is produced by Rustic Roots. They are video storytellers passionate about sharing the impact of nonprofits. From story ideation to beautiful and powerful videos on screen, they've got you covered. Learn more at Rusticroots.co.