Joy As A Liberatory Practice with Frank Velásquez Jr.
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In This Episode
Content warning: This episode includes discussion of trauma, systemic harm, and experiences of marginalization, shared with care and intention.
This conversation begins with a truth many of us feel but don’t always name, that while trauma-informed storytelling often centers pain and loss, there is another force that has sustained communities for generations: joy.
In today’s episode of When Bearing Witness, we sit down with the Founder of 4 Da Hood, Frank Velásquez Jr., to explore joy not as an escape from hard work, but as a form of resistance and a pathway back to our full humanity. Frank reflects on what it has meant to reclaim joy personally – as a leader, storyteller, and entrepreneur – and how collective joy shows up in spaces where people of color gather together.
This conversation examines how joy lives alongside grief, how laughter can coexist with difficult conversations, and how choosing to lead with aspiration rather than deficit can fundamentally shift the way stories are told and received. From nonprofit storytelling to leadership culture, this episode invites us to imagine what becomes possible when joy is not an afterthought, but a deliberate, liberatory practice.
About Frank Velásquez Jr.
Storyteller Extraordinaire, Social Justice Warrior and Architect of Relations, Frank Velásquez Jr., relentlessly pursues racial and gender equity, while creatively connecting our stories, preserving the unique flavor of each one like in a yummy bowl of gumbo. As Founder of 4 Da Hood and the mastermind behind the Ascending Leaders in Color leadership program, he’s forging paths for peeps of color to lead with more authenticity, courage, and joy! Because for Frank, advancing equity isn’t just a job – it’s a movement towards building generational wealth for communities of color to thrive! And he's doing it one connection, one story, one courageous conversation at a time.
Connect with Frank Velásquez Jr.
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Transcripts
Maria: In this episode, we're stepping into a conversation that feels like medicine. When we talk about trauma-informed storytelling and collective care, we often focus on the wounds and the weight. But there's another truth that has carried communities of color for generations: Joy. Joy is resistance. Accessing it is liberation, and when we reclaim our joy, we forge the pathway back to our full humanity. To guide us through this lens, I'm joined by Frank Velazquez, Jr. Frank is a storyteller extraordinaire, a social justice warrior and architect of relations. As the founder of For Hood and the creator of Ascending Leaders in Color Program, he's building spaces where leaders of color can lead with more authenticity, courage, and joy.
His work reminds us that equity work is not only about dismantling systems of harm, it's about cultivating practices that allow communities of color to thrive, connect and build generational wealth. Frank brings a spirit that is rooted in truth telling and joy spreading. We'll explore what joy as resistance really means and what becomes possible when our sector and our movement fully embrace joy as a liberatory practice. Frank, I am so here for this conversation. Thank you for being on When Bearing Witness.
Frank: I'm excited about having this conversation because even as you read out that bio authenticity, courage, and joy, only talk about the authenticity. I don't really talk about the courage or the joy. So I've made it an effort for 2026 to really talk about the joy.
Maria: I'm so excited to explore it further. What does joy mean to you, both on a personal level and a collective level?
Frank: Great question. I want to start by saying joy, on a personal level, plays a huge role in my life. Especially when I think about humor, laughter, comedy, these are things that, I feel like I'm a funny person and when I talk about in these spaces on podcasts, I happen to notice that I wasn't accessing my joy.
I was talking about all of the hurt, the harm, the need for the spaces for people of color, which are all true, I never really talked about the joy component of it. So on a personal level, like I said, that was meaningful that I express that part of who I am especially as I am in spaces like this. In regard to the collective, on a collective level,, We know the work that we do is hard. We can access that joy to honestly help us continue through that space. And so that's why Joy, I feel, is prevalent in both of those spaces. With me personally, I felt I needed to showcase a little bit more of who I am to, to people in these spaces, and then the impact of collective joy, just how it brings us together and helps us move through the difficult periods which we're going through.
Maria: Joy is something we're capable of finding on our own, but it compounds when you're with others and you're a community builder, and so it's when you're bringing people together, there is something just so crucial, important but lovely about bringing joy into those spaces in that container.
Frank: Agree.
Maria: We are up against a lot. We are uncovering conversations that people don't necessarily want to have. We're in the business of unlearning and helping folks learn again and there's something about how we can still.
Bring joy into these conversations to celebrate our wins, to laugh. That is part of the work. So tell me that more like why, like why are you choosing joy and why is this such an important part of this work?
Frank: As you were talking, Maria I immediately started to think about some of the cohorts that I've had with the Ascending Leaders in Color. we're talking about hard stuff. We're talking about microaggressions, the effects of assimilation, code switching, all of the harmful things that wear down people of color. And then I immediately thought of all of the times where we would laugh collectively. So my third cohort specifically, we would meet on Saturdays and I just, that group was particularly funny. And I'm not saying that the others weren't, but it just. I remember those moments where we were collectively laughing and talking about this hard stuff, and I think that's the important reminder is that yeah, we're doing hard stuff.
Yeah, we're going through stuff, but it's the cookout it's the quinceañera, it's all of these spaces where we get to be with one another and laugh and be joyful and expressive, because it really does, I feel, heal us in a way that. That we can't do on our own.
So that's where I feel like the collective joy comes into place.
I'll give another example of just myself. I had a tough summer. This was my first, full summer on my own as an entrepreneur. And it was relatively slow and I could feel me getting into a little bit of a funk and. It's so interesting. So I put it out there on LinkedIn. I even, I think I might've even called it that, that it was in a funk. so many people reached out and so many people just wanting to talk, giving me, either support connecting me to other folks. And that, in and of itself, made me joyful, and it helped me come out of that funk probably way sooner than I had expected. But I needed that.
I needed to have that piece of where I was connecting to these lovely people who took time out of their days to reach out to me and say, Frank, I'm with you. And to have those moments of joy as just, it really got me into a good space as I was exiting the summer.
Maria: When I think of ascending leaders of color, I think of the fact that when you meet in person, you kick off with a meal together, sharing food, and to me that's joy. Like to me, that's such a joyful, wonderful thing to do, and I think that's a way to cultivate joy.
Frank: Who doesn't get happy when you're eating. It's like good food too.
Maria: Exactly.
Frank: very intentional, breaking bread together. I also wanted to get away from and I'm thinking about a future session on this, but there's something called like the characteristics, the. White supremacy characteristicsics that show up in the workplace, and one of them would be like timeliness, and not saying that people of color are not timely, but when, let's say you have a meeting at 5:00 PM it's like they started at 5:00 PM and it's right down to business. Whereas people of color, communities of color, leaders of color, typically use those for 15 minutes.
To reconnect, to reengage. And I think that's so important. And so that was very intentional in Ascending Leaders in Color, was to recreate that and say, look, you're not late. Yes. It says we start at five 30, but five 30 to six is when we eat. Six o'clock is when we start.
Maria: Thank you for being vulnerable about having a difficult summer and. Even deeper that you're cultivating really difficult conversations, and I think that we can get into the habit of feeling like there's just no place for joy in a year like this. In a time like this when we're experiencing things like this.
Frank: Yeah.
Maria: What is keeping people from accessing joy? And I'm curious, what are barriers that we are afraid to talk about when it comes to accessing joy?
Frank: To answer the first one what's keeping people from accessing joy? think honestly is we get caught up in the day to day, and when we're having a particularly difficult year, or if you are, especially in the space of nonprofits when funding is being cut, there's all of these stressors that are. Being compounded. so it is very difficult to access joy. Again, I'll give the example of the ALC. You have nine individuals in their own spaces really dealing with the day-to-day. And then you bring 'em into a space together and suddenly it's joyful. don't know if it's because there's a shared experience but I think that is what is preventing people from accessing joy because they're so caught up in that bubble of isolation, of just trying to get from day one to day two to day three to day four.
And in regards to the second half of your question, what are the barriers that often go unnamed? I think I named off a few. It's just the struggles of the day to day. I don't know if there's anything specific in regards to barriers, but sometimes they are external barriers. sometimes they're internal barriers. so I think either way those barriers do prevent us from accessing it. And so I think naming it and seeing it is really the first step or even just reframing it. So literally this conversation we're having is about joy, is resistance. If we can't see joy as resistance, then I think that's what's gonna prevent us from then accessing joy. Once we acknowledge that our joy, our mere presence, our laughter the community that we're in, that is a form of resistance because I think there's certain groups that want us to. Feel isolated
Be angry. And so the mere fact that I can come together in a space like this with you in a space like the storytelling conference with all of our friends a space, like in a setting, leaders in color, and we can laugh and collectively have that joy, it's so critical.
Often what we do in restorative circles is we create agreements. And those agreements I think, help provide or create the safety be joyful.. Because if we're providing an environment where they feel safe to share. Guess what happens? They can do all their emotions
So to Joy is resistance, accessing it is liberation. I think as I was thinking through this, I've always known that joy is resistance. maybe I've not always, seen it. I heard it, but I didn't feel it. and as I'm moving through this new space of my life as an entrepreneur and certainly leaning more and more into the work that I do. I do see that as being able to move through these difficult spaces and having my joy and really sharing it. And but it's not just knowing that joy is resistance. That's why the second half is there, is accessing, it is liberation. So I think I may have known joy is resistance, but if I'm not accessing it, I'm still in this. Cage and once I start accessing my joy, I feel liberated. I feel empowered to say anything and everything that I want to, and particularly from the lens of an entrepreneur the founder for the hood. That is even more the fact that I'm able to, if when I'm able to access my joy, feel. I'm building more and more of my authenticity in the spaces that, that I'm in because Joy, as I mentioned earlier, that laughter, comedy telling jokes, that is a huge part of who I am and it's taken me some time to realize the more I can. it the more free I feel and liberated. And I think as I do a lot of modeling, I think also helps give permission to others who are in my sessions to then do that too. And I do that very intentionally where I'm modeling what I want, whoever's in my sessions to say, Hey, it's okay. Being you is what's going to make you feel most free, most liberated. And more courageous and more authentic.
Maria: So we're talking a lot about joy in spaces. I wanna talk about how this. Translates into storytelling. So much of nonprofit storytelling and social sector storytelling. We focus on trauma. Even in our work, we focus on harm. Even that stories can have, we focus so much on. Trauma and harm and violence and sometimes there we need that to move, through.
But what happens when our stories center joy and we make choices to center joy in our stories.
Frank: I think such a great question. I think there's this activation that happens, and this goes to actually the asset-based. And deficit framed. So typically in the nonprofit sector, we lead with the deficit frame. We say all of the pain, all of the things because we're trying to create a sense of, pity or, I don't know, like othering. So imagine if we led with joy. And so what I mean by that is I use this story. I name him Hyman. I talk about some of the hard stuff and I lead off with that deficit frame story saying his living situation, blah, blah, blah. And then the alternative is, I say Hyman wants to be a doctor. And it is such a difference where I think if the audience is oh, he wants to be a doctor.
Frank: I'm leaning in out of love and care of what he wants to do. And yes, I can say, and here's his situation, the mere fact of just leading with the aspirations changes the whole tone of not only the story. I think the feelings that then the listener of the story is feeling like, even me just saying it right now, I felt like these little butterflies, oh my gosh, Hyman wants to be a doctor.
Frank: That's fricking cool.
Maria: Right.
Frank: so I think we make these little shifts, it changes our brain chemistry, how we're hearing the messages and how we're taking them in. It just literally flips. Everything. And we're not leading from a place of deficit. We're leading from a place of love and joy and care, and I wanna know more about Hyman's story. If I know that he wants to be a doctor and I wanna remove those, help remove those obstacles so he can be where he wants to be.
Maria: It's grounding for the story. It totally shifts where we want that story to go and it changes our role in the story when we like, when we just ground it in these aspirations and the inspiration of who, not even who he could be. It's who he is. It's in there, so I am here for leading 2026 with Joy and right alongside you.
If you imagine a future where Joy is fully embraced as resistance and accessing it is understood as liberation, how would our organization's leadership and movements be transformed by that shift?
Frank: It shifts how our brain sees things, and if organizations and folks and leaders continue to access. Or put forth the joy component. It really does shift how your employees look at it, how communities everything, all of those pieces.
Frank: So I think that's the transformation we lead with what can be versus what isn't. I think I, there's a ton of books out there. One, I think, oh my gosh, I think it's I think there's a book about this, but I'm blanking on the title right now, so you can cut that out.
'cause I don't think that's the book. So I think when organizations are able to access those points, it really does have a huge shift in how performance is, how employee retention is, of those things. And I shouldn't even say it only from a leadership standpoint. I want to say it starts with communities. When communities. When we listen to communities, especially those who are, have been traditionally and historically marginalized and see how they operate, oh my God, like I'm getting goosebumps. I think about little things like folks who don't have money yet they still are having these. Amazing times at barbecues and cookouts and just love and care and laughter. I love seeing that. And if we just looked at that from the standpoint of oh, you don't need money to be happy. You don't need tons of money to be kind. It's those little pieces where. If we only just look what we already see in front of us from the communities that have, again, have been historically marginalized, the joy that they bring every day, and we all could learn from that.
Maria: Frank, what is bringing you joy and laughter these days?
Frank: So I'm in a relationship, so I probably need to lead with that. So that brings me a lot of joy. She's fantastic. She's funny. I love that we play off each other in regards to even just language, it's just back and forth. Like you pretty, no, you pretty, no, you pretty it just makes me laugh.
So that brings me a lot of joy and I think honestly in the storytelling conference is a great example of this. Maria was, I finally got to meet you in person.
Maria: Finally.
Frank: So that was really exciting. And it's all these little pieces where I get to have these. conversations. I've said this before, I've probably said it here. I'm an extroverted introvert. People tend to think I'm an introvert an extrovert because of the work that I do. And in large pieces I can play that role. But the older I get, I lean more into my introversion, which means I really like the one-on-one conversations. And when I get to have those one-on-one conversations, I get to learn about somebody on a deeper level than if I was talking to a group of people. Two things really bring me joy, this person. And then relationships in general. The platonic relationships that I've built and have really fostered and nurtured and I really try to I just said I really try to ensure that I'm nurturing them. It's very easy for me to just get back into my world again as an introvert. And I'm really trying to be more intentional of accessing those folks and bringing in new people into my inner circle. And I've shared this with you, Maria, before, I have a lot of people in my inner circle. that's not by design. I want to expand and, you're one of these people that is in my inner circle where if I know something's bothering me that I can just reach out to you. I hope I'm that, that I'm offering that to you as well, where if something's bothering you, are the things that bring me joy is just really nurturing and fostering these wonderful relationships.
Maria: What is making you laugh these days? Like you talked a little bit about enjoying comedy. Maybe it's a show or a podcast. I'm not gonna say book because come.
Frank: Oh my gosh. It's, plays a huge role, so standup comedy,
Maria: Who are your favorites?
Frank: We just saw live Josh Johnson.
Maria: Oh, you're kidding.
Frank: from the Daily Show,
Maria: Yeah.
Frank: I don't know, standup comedy,
Maria: Isn't the best.
Frank: it always brings me joy and if they're good and which Josh Johnson.
Josh Johnson is incredible. He's an incredible storyteller. So it's
Maria: Yeah
Frank: even that alone, it's like.
Maria: it's all storytelling.
Frank: talking. It's
Maria: Yeah. Yeah.
Frank: incredible. So I would say that's currently bringing me joy. And certainly, yeah, when I watch any, have to like the person who's giving the, giving it, but yeah, comedy, standup comedy tends to get me most happy. And then like shows like St. Denis Medical Abbott Elementary, like these fake documentary, I'm always watching those because they just, they're so
Maria: There's a new one, Paper.
Frank: Oh yeah. Yeah, I saw that as well. It is, but definitely Abbott Elementary and St.
Dennis Medical are two of my favorite
Maria: yeah.
Frank: 'cause so funny.
Maria: So standup comedy has played a huge role in my life because growing up in New York City, there were very few things I could. Do under the age of 21. I couldn't go clubbing or anything like that, but like we could go to comedy clubs, you have to buy two drinks, but they could be Coca-Cola or Pepsi.
Maria: So I just, my high school years, I was immersed in the standup comedy scene in New York City. It was so fun. So yeah, when I think about that, I think of my like coming of age years and I dated a lot of comedians, they're like truly extroverted and I'm so introverted.
But that was definitely my type in high school and college. Aw, Frank, thank you so much for coming on this show. What do you have cooking in 2026? How can people follow you? How can people work with you?
Frank: Yeah, for sure. I'll start by answering your second question first. ForTheHood.com. Just come, It's 4DaHood.com. Is a great way and I'd love to connect with people on LinkedIn. I have made future friends on LinkedIn. Especially if there's an upcoming event. It's oh.
You're gonna be there. I'm gonna be there. Let's talk before the event and and, but in regards to 2026, 3 things. One, I want to continue growing ascending leaders in color. And I've shared this with you, Maria, that I want you to be part of my white ally group for sure. Two is I would like to create a conference around. we're talking about, Ascending Leaders in Color the topic. So I haven't fully fleshed it out. I've had a couple of folks that I've really talked about it, and they're like, Frank, you need to create this.
Again, to me it's what's an added value and what maybe I can give people a taste of what a Ascending Leaders in Color is all about through a one day conference. So I'm really wanting to figure that out. But the third piece is I'm going to write a book. And so it's, it took me about. Up three months. To come up with the idea. The way my brain works is I need to have the title first and so I won't let the cat out of the bag. But once I have the title, it opened up everything else.
Maria: I know that feeling.
Frank: I'll tell you this piece about the book is, there's gonna be different chapters with different topics.
Frank: It's essentially from ascending leaders. But I'm going to write it. Each chapter is gonna have. Where I'm writing it to people of color and where I'm writing it to white allies,
Maria: love that.
Frank: So I'm really excited about that concept because I create in person or virtually, I intentionally keep the groups separate because they need their separate healing spaces. But the intent is always to have them come back together to lead collectively. But in a book. Harm there, there's no interaction or the intent of harm because there's nobody else there. You are the reader. So I feel that they can interchange on either side and say, Frank, that's exactly what I want to tell my white friend. Or from the white side saying, I didn't know
How can we then work together to lead collectively?
Maria: I'm so excited for that. What a year.
Frank: I know.
Maria: You're beaming. I'm beaming. We should be talking about joy more often and what a great way to kick off the new year. So yeah.
Thank you so much, Frank.
Frank: Hey, thank you. Appreciate you.